First, let us all agree on a rule. If someone pulls a quickhammer again, then we vote them off the next day. Period.

anyway.

We shouldn't be afraid of miss-elim this early on. What we need right now is information. Plus, voting someone off gives the voters point to help them in the game. It's important that those who benefit from this exotic mechanic are town and not scum, the more points are given to town player, the bigger advantage to town.

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

Yhuan Debeste wrote: 5h2o60

what do we do now

figure out a strategy

is it good idea to reveal roles since they will be replaced anyway?

I suppose it makes sense for town to tell their negative role. Not only does it help weed out scum, it also means we can coordinate which town should do the voting so that town with the worst ability get points to clear their negative role.

What would scum gain from knowing our negative role? I don't think scum has much to exploit from knowing my negative ability, or rather, any attempt at exploiting my ability will make people look very sus.

to be clear. I am not claiming scum have nothing to gain from knowing our negative role. I am asking the rest of town because I personally don't know.

Also @town it's best not to reveal when and if your negative role is gone.

not sure if its better or worse to reveal negative roles.

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

Also @town it's best not to reveal when and if your negative role is gone.

also, got it, do i reveal my negative role now tho?

samX500 wrote: 4e1z5d

First, let us all agree on a rule. If someone pulls a quickhammer again, then we vote them off the next day. Period.

Now there is a teensy-weensy problem with this...

my neg role is ive hammerer lol

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

- All Players will start with a Negative Role.

It'd be funny if scum negative role was to ively revive a town player

you clearly see where I got thos idea from now lol

oh well, might as well say it

my negative role is uninformed, this would mean i am blindly picking my role and path because the path and role i'll pick will not be said to me until i use my points on it

tl;dr my role and path will be a surprise

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

samX500 wrote: 4e1z5d

First, let us all agree on a rule. If someone pulls a quickhammer again, then we vote them off the next day. Period.

Now there is a teensy-weensy problem with this...

my neg role is ive hammerer lol

also damn thats pretty bad to have if you are town and don't wanna quickhammer.

i feel like its better to keep ppl at E-2 if we do not want any sudden hammers until we are completely sure

the only problem with keeping people at E-2 is if there is someone with a negative role that randomizes their vote

oh we can reveal roles now? I can do nothing but My voting is restricted

I cannot hammer

Yhuan Debeste wrote: 5h2o60

I cannot hammer

does your vote not counts?

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

Yhuan Debeste wrote: 5h2o60

I cannot hammer

does your vote not counts?

it does, I just can't be last vote I think

Yhuan Debeste wrote: 5h2o60

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

Yhuan Debeste wrote: 5h2o60

I cannot hammer

does your vote not counts?

it does, I just can't be last vote I think

Oh so if it [E-1] and you vote, then your vote doesn't matter?

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

Yhuan Debeste wrote: 5h2o60

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

Yhuan Debeste wrote: 5h2o60

I cannot hammer

does your vote not counts?

it does, I just can't be last vote I think

Oh so if it [E-1] and you vote, then your vote doesn't matter?

I mean yeah I can't do that so...

Oh that's worse than mine

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

oh we can reveal roles now? I can do nothing but My voting is restricted

wait, you can't vote at all? or is it something like: vote once and you are permanently stuck with who you voted for

pentaqola wrote: 576830

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

oh we can reveal roles now? I can do nothing but My voting is restricted

wait, you can't vote at all? or is it something like: vote once and you are permanently stuck with who you voted for

I have 2 people that i can't vote

Should I reveal my negative

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

Should I reveal my negative

i doubt scum can use that to their advantage, so go ahead.

the only thing you shouldn't do is reveal your path and such, and if the negative is gone.

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

pentaqola wrote: 576830

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

oh we can reveal roles now? I can do nothing but My voting is restricted

wait, you can't vote at all? or is it something like: vote once and you are permanently stuck with who you voted for

I have 2 people that i can't vote

two?

My negative is that I will die at the beginning of day 3

I don’t think it’s gonna affect me that much as I could just remove the role

Yhuan Debeste wrote: 5h2o60

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

pentaqola wrote: 576830

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

oh we can reveal roles now? I can do nothing but My voting is restricted

wait, you can't vote at all? or is it something like: vote once and you are permanently stuck with who you voted for

I have 2 people that i can't vote

two?

this, is it just two specific person in one day, or is it randomized?

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

My negative is that I will die at the beginning of day 3

I don’t think it’s gonna affect me that much as I could just remove the role

also what the fuck, thats gotta be the worst negative if you don't manage to get it out in time

correction for my first sentence cuz it fucked up

is it locked to two specific people, or is it randomized.

i feel like if its locked to two only, that's a really bad thing if one of em is mafia or the two of em are

Two specific person

I don't think that there is a specific reasoning of why I can't vote them so i think it's pretty much vanilla but worse lol

well since i haven't posted my mandatory present post yet, i might as well reveal my neg since everyone else is doing it.

anyways my neg is my ability only works 50% of the time.

gg sub_kun

well shoot, there he goes.

hopefully bambi is at least active this time

Bruh this man wanted to play so much yet he failed to respond

My negative is like kinda weird tbh

If pentaqola dies then I can't do anything with my Path Points except for getting perks

so yeah please penta don't die

Ehhh can you explain more

I’m really confuse on what your negative is

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

Ehhh can you explain more

I’m really confuse on what your negative is

My negative is that, if for whatever reason pentaqola dies, I will only be able to spend my Path Points on perks and I will not be able to unlock a new role

Morning guys

We should be using votes for pressure and etc., but we should be coordinating wagons once we decide on a vote so that we can funnel points onto people that are a lot more likely to be town than not.

My negative role is that my night action targeting has a 50% chance of being randomized.

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

pentaqola wrote: 576830

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

oh we can reveal roles now? I can do nothing but My voting is restricted

wait, you can't vote at all? or is it something like: vote once and you are permanently stuck with who you voted for

I have 2 people that i can't vote

You should out this now, just in case.

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

My negative is that I will die at the beginning of day 3

I don’t think it’s gonna affect me that much as I could just remove the role

As a warning to everybody, this means that if ShinRun doesn't remove this and we remove town days 1 and 2 (with no stopped kills), we instantly lose.

If we hit town day one, we should force ShinRun to the start of the wagon we decide on day two to prevent this.

Amianki wrote: 4f234j

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

pentaqola wrote: 576830

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

oh we can reveal roles now? I can do nothing but My voting is restricted

wait, you can't vote at all? or is it something like: vote once and you are permanently stuck with who you voted for

I have 2 people that i can't vote

You should out this now, just in case.

Shin and Yhu

My negative role is that if I am eliminated by town vote, the next day phase will be skipped. So essentially if you eliminate me there will be two night in a row and thus two scum kill.

As long as you trust that I am town, this doesn't do anything. Though this would be the ultimate excuse for a scum to prevent themselves from being voted off.

Also voting Sam off will speed up my death

So this is an interesting thought

1. Let's assume bambinex and penta are town
2. Based on bambinex's role, if penta is nk'd then scum can do double the damage to town
3. Damage 1: Penta, a town is nk'd. Damage 2: Town will be left with one less good role (bambinex's neg role)
4. Therefore, scum should target penta
5. However, this makes things way way too easy for scum and is quite unbalanced
6. Because of this, it does not make sense for both penta and bambi to be town - one of them are scum

Penta scum offers balanced gameplay. Scum is killed, but as a double edged sword, town looses a role.
Bambi scum offers gameplay in favor of town. Scum is killed and nothing bad happens to town

So what be it hmmm...

Also Yhuan cannot hammer. Idk how that's a negative role if you're town.

@Igorsprite We spend our path point during the night, but when does it take effect? It's not clear from the rules what the priority of ability is during the night.

aight, listing down the negative roles here


just doing this for future reference here, it might come in handy in ing the neg roles

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

So this is an interesting thought

1. Let's assume bambinex and penta are town
2. Based on bambinex's role, if penta is nk'd then scum can do double the damage to town
3. Damage 1: Penta, a town is nk'd. Damage 2: Town will be left with one less good role (bambinex's neg role)
4. Therefore, scum should target penta
5. However, this makes things way way too easy for scum and is quite unbalanced
6. Because of this, it does not make sense for both penta and bambi to be town - one of them are scum

Penta scum offers balanced gameplay. Scum is killed, but as a double edged sword, town looses a role.
Bambi scum offers gameplay in favor of town. Scum is killed and nothing bad happens to town

So what be it hmmm...

i like this thought mainly because it delves into the negative role bambi has, however i can see some ways mafia can handle this setup.

if for example penta = town and bambi = scum, mafia can plan on keeping me alive until n2 or n3, or maybe until they see me as useless. this might favor town at first, but if kept for long it can cause some problems

if it is the other way around, they have the choice of voting me off in a specific day before bambi gets better roles. practically sacrificing me to cause problems to town. if they do sacrifice me, chances are its because my role for them is absolutely terrible and useless for what i have gotten blindly

if however this ends up being town + town for the two of us, I'll probably be dead at the next day, if not then i really wish that a town investigative role checks on this

i think the bambi scum, penta town thing can be balanced by rng by the way.

if i get a shitty and useless role and path (since i literally don't know what i am gonna pick), i can become a problem for town despite being town. this will be helpful for mafia as they have one less problem to deal with, if i ever become a problem in the first place

I don’t think we should assume who is scum based on their negative role

yeah I'm pretty sure role =/= allignment

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

I don’t think we should assume who is scum based on their negative role

i think you are right

we shouldn't assume who is scum just based off role either way

and we already lost multiple games due to this form of assumption

pentaqola wrote: 576830

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

I don’t think we should assume who is scum based on their negative role

i think you are right

we shouldn't assume who is scum just based off role either way

and we already lost multiple games due to this form of assumption

It doesn't make sense for town to have negative roles that actually hurt town but scum not.

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

pentaqola wrote: 576830

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

I don’t think we should assume who is scum based on their negative role

i think you are right

we shouldn't assume who is scum just based off role either way

and we already lost multiple games due to this form of assumption

It doesn't make sense for town to have negative roles that actually hurt town but scum not.

wait, are you saying that we could assume via negative roles only?

@Mod: Is it public knowledge whether the mafia have fakeclaims or not, and if so, do they?

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

pentaqola wrote: 576830

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

I don’t think we should assume who is scum based on their negative role

i think you are right

we shouldn't assume who is scum just based off role either way

and we already lost multiple games due to this form of assumption

It doesn't make sense for town to have negative roles that actually hurt town but scum not.

But I feel like if this is true, it would be too obvious

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

pentaqola wrote: 576830

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

I don’t think we should assume who is scum based on their negative role

i think you are right

we shouldn't assume who is scum just based off role either way

and we already lost multiple games due to this form of assumption

It doesn't make sense for town to have negative roles that actually hurt town but scum not.

But I feel like if this is true, it would be too obvious

Well I dont expect igor to think everything through

Judging by how you guys play these games most of you don't seem to look deeper than what happens on surface

I'm assuming we want everyone to reveal their negatives then?

Yhuan Debeste wrote: 5h2o60

I'm assuming we want everyone to reveal their negatives then?

Didn’t everyone already reveal their negative role tho

did they? I lost count

I counted 6

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

based on the red names, those are the ones you feel like has the possibility to be scum

yes?

or are they because they are rooted to another person's role?

pentaqola wrote: 576830

or are they because they are rooted to another person's role?

as i see it, the red names are related to another person's role

also any benefits or drawbacks for not voting?

samX500 wrote: 4e1z5d

@Igorsprite We spend our path point during the night, but when does it take effect? It's not clear from the rules what the priority of ability is during the night.

You can use your ability the moment you unlocks it. Nightkills will be the last thing resolving.

Amianki wrote: 4f234j

@Mod: Is it public knowledge whether the mafia have fakeclaims or not, and if so, do they?

if i understood correctly, i will not PM a role that they don't have and i don't mind if someone say a role that i didn't PM

Wait how long is prod time?

pentaqola wrote: 576830

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

based on the red names, those are the ones you feel like has the possibility to be scum

pentaqola wrote: 576830

or are they because they are rooted to another person's role?

rooted to another person's role

So if we’re assuming who’s scum based on their negative role, wouldn’t Cleveland and Amianki be the least scum since their role basically randomize the chance of them killing who they want to kill if they’re mafia

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

So if we’re assuming who’s scum based on their negative role, wouldn’t Cleveland and Amianki be the least scum since their role basically randomize the chance of them killing who they want to kill if they’re mafia

how does that make them least scum?

samX500 wrote: 4e1z5d

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

So if we’re assuming who’s scum based on their negative role, wouldn’t Cleveland and Amianki be the least scum since their role basically randomize the chance of them killing who they want to kill if they’re mafia

how does that make them least scum?

Since this would really mess their plan up if they were scum

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

samX500 wrote: 4e1z5d

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

So if we’re assuming who’s scum based on their negative role, wouldn’t Cleveland and Amianki be the least scum since their role basically randomize the chance of them killing who they want to kill if they’re mafia

how does that make them least scum?

Since this would really mess their plan up if they were scum

???

Amianki's role is bad for both sides but scum are extra fucked if the kill is randomized onto another scum

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

samX500 wrote: 4e1z5d

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

So if we’re assuming who’s scum based on their negative role, wouldn’t Cleveland and Amianki be the least scum since their role basically randomize the chance of them killing who they want to kill if they’re mafia

how does that make them least scum?

Since this would really mess their plan up if they were scum

???

Amianki's role is bad for both sides but scum are extra fucked if the kill is randomized onto another scum

If amianki is scum and can kill, he is basically blind then?

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

samX500 wrote: 4e1z5d

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

So if we’re assuming who’s scum based on their negative role, wouldn’t Cleveland and Amianki be the least scum since their role basically randomize the chance of them killing who they want to kill if they’re mafia

how does that make them least scum?

Since this would really mess their plan up if they were scum

???

Amianki's role is bad for both sides but scum are extra fucked if the kill is randomized onto another scum

If amianki is scum and can kill, he is basically blind then?

Well 50% chance that he would be blind

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

samX500 wrote: 4e1z5d

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

So if we’re assuming who’s scum based on their negative role, wouldn’t Cleveland and Amianki be the least scum since their role basically randomize the chance of them killing who they want to kill if they’re mafia

how does that make them least scum?

Since this would really mess their plan up if they were scum

???

Amianki's role is bad for both sides but scum are extra fucked if the kill is randomized onto another scum

Exactly

Exactly

That’s why I’m saying they’re have the least scum negative role

Also I’m not here to debate whether someone is scum based on their role but instead I’m saying that judging who’s scum based on their role is a terrible idea

The negative role literally do nothing if we use our points to remove them so why are we even arguing about it


On an unrelated note, do we only learn points by voting someone

Realized I wrote “exactly twice”

Well since this is new territory let's decide whether we should judge neg roles like that.

Imo we should because certain roles may give a massive advantage to scum if that's true. I simply don't believe the game would be set up to skew in favor of scum that bad.

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

Well since this is new territory let's decide whether we should judge neg roles like that.

kinda skeptical but hey i dont oppose something new

prod dodge

Prod skip
Don't have anything to say

Prod skip

i'm rather blank too other than

ClevelandsMyBro wrote: 58np

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

Well since this is new territory let's decide whether we should judge neg roles like that.

kinda skeptical but hey i dont oppose something new

i mean, why not. we are all new to this and since this is the first day, we can develop strategies and such for now

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

Well since this is new territory let's decide whether we should judge neg roles like that.

Imo we should because certain roles may give a massive advantage to scum if that's true. I simply don't believe the game would be set up to skew in favor of scum that bad.

I do agree with abraker. We need to that scum also have negative ability. If someone has a negative ability that is bad if they are scum, but that is good if they are town, then we can probably extrapolate that that person is a scum.

Let's say I am not lying about my ability (If eliminated via town vote, skip next day phase). If I am scum, this is 100% a positive ability for me to have. So I wouldn't have that as a negative ability if I am scum.

I still wouldn’t prefer to vote someone based on their negative ability

I feel like voting for those that are most inactive are better since you gain roles and ability over time

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

I still wouldn’t prefer to vote someone based on their negative ability

I feel like voting for those that are most inactive are better since you gain roles and ability over time

are you telling us that we should vote for bambinex?

if yes, damn i am betting he would get the yhuan curse real fast when we put him in other mafia games

pentaqola wrote: 576830

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

I still wouldn’t prefer to vote someone based on their negative ability

I feel like voting for those that are most inactive are better since you gain roles and ability over time

are you telling us that we should vote for bambinex?

if yes, damn i am betting he would get the yhuan curse real fast when we put him in other mafia games

Kinda ig since unlike other games, we gain ability the more we play so those who barely talk are probably not gonna be any help during the first few days of the game

Also it’s not like they have any useful ability right now so there isn’t really backlash for voting them off

Dodge

Sorry, too much on my mind lately

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

Prod skip
Don't have anything to say

Amianki wrote: 4f234j

Dodge

Sorry, too much on my mind lately

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

Well since this is new territory let's decide whether we should judge neg roles like that.

Imo we should because certain roles may give a massive advantage to scum if that's true. I simply don't believe the game would be set up to skew in favor of scum that bad.

You two, thoughts on this?

pentaqola wrote: 576830

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

I don’t think we should assume who is scum based on their negative role

i think you are right

we shouldn't assume who is scum just based off role either way

and we already lost multiple games due to this form of assumption

pentaqola wrote: 576830

ClevelandsMyBro wrote: 58np

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

Well since this is new territory let's decide whether we should judge neg roles like that.

kinda skeptical but hey i dont oppose something new

i mean, why not. we are all new to this and since this is the first day, we can develop strategies and such for now

This kind of indecisiveness is what will fuck us up

Ngl Penta seems all over the place

replacement dodge

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

Well since this is new territory let's decide whether we should judge neg roles like that.

Imo we should because certain roles may give a massive advantage to scum if that's true. I simply don't believe the game would be set up to skew in favor of scum that bad.

I don't think we should do that because well that doesn't mean anything, like maybe igor just gave the negs randomly hence a townie could have a neg that is bad for scum, but the problem is that we don't know how igor has given the roles, so at least for now we shouldn't take them in

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

NotRaffi wrote: 171b11

Prod skip
Don't have anything to say

Amianki wrote: 4f234j

Dodge

Sorry, too much on my mind lately

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

Well since this is new territory let's decide whether we should judge neg roles like that.

Imo we should because certain roles may give a massive advantage to scum if that's true. I simply don't believe the game would be set up to skew in favor of scum that bad.

You two, thoughts on this?

I think it's mostly meaningless since we know very little about the setup currently. It's very hard to tell whether any of this is even relevant to alignment until we can be reasonably sure whether they tie into our abilities or not.

The fact that scum apparently don't have fake claims either indicates that there isn't much correlation between our negatives and alignment or that there isn't enough forethought put into each role as a whole to make it cohesive (which can be checked by what abilities everyone has available to them)

Amianki wrote: 4f234j

The fact that scum apparently don't have fake claims either indicates that there isn't much correlation between our negatives and alignment or that there isn't enough forethought put into each role as a whole to make it cohesive (which can be checked by what abilities everyone has available to them)

If you are right, then this worries me

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

So this is an interesting thought

1. Let's assume bambinex and penta are town
2. Based on bambinex's role, if penta is nk'd then scum can do double the damage to town
3. Damage 1: Penta, a town is nk'd. Damage 2: Town will be left with one less good role (bambinex's neg role)
4. Therefore, scum should target penta
5. However, this makes things way way too easy for scum and is quite unbalanced
6. Because of this, it does not make sense for both penta and bambi to be town - one of them are scum

Penta scum offers balanced gameplay. Scum is killed, but as a double edged sword, town looses a role.
Bambi scum offers gameplay in favor of town. Scum is killed and nothing bad happens to town

So what be it hmmm...

If both bambinex and penta are town, then town as a whole is already at a disadvantage. I'd rather believe that one of them are scum rather than believe that gameplay is unbalanced

I guess we will wait for D2 to know what to do with penta. What will happen is either

- town spares penta, he dies at night, flips town
- town spares penta, doesn't die at night cause he is scum

shouldn't*

sorry I don't read my messages again before posting them so expect dumb typing errors like this one to appear quite often

This kind of thing is exactly why I say we need to be planning who is on wagons ahead of time

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

pentaqola wrote: 576830

ShinRun wrote: 4p6j2

I don’t think we should assume who is scum based on their negative role

i think you are right

we shouldn't assume who is scum just based off role either way

and we already lost multiple games due to this form of assumption

pentaqola wrote: 576830

ClevelandsMyBro wrote: 58np

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

Well since this is new territory let's decide whether we should judge neg roles like that.

kinda skeptical but hey i dont oppose something new

i mean, why not. we are all new to this and since this is the first day, we can develop strategies and such for now

This kind of indecisiveness is what will fuck us up

i'm sorry for being indecisive, this is mostly my fault for trying to get into what you are going for because you prefer that way.

the reason i did this is just to see what can be done with assuming via negative roles. i should have just questioned, but i wanna see whats about it fully cuz in reality i see every role as negative no matter the side. also, this is the first day, and if someone gets a role thats good but their negative role literally hinders that. it literally doesn't matter that side it is, it's just bad.

abraker wrote: 6cx2d

I guess we will wait for D2 to know what to do with penta. What will happen is either

- town spares penta, he dies at night, flips town
- town spares penta, doesn't die at night cause he is scum

if you are going for the assumption that one night proves my side then this is extremely faulty.

you literally gave out the thought that: what if bambi is scum and penta is town; you know that they'll keep me alive if bambi is scum, and for some reason would rather vote me out than vote bambi out

this is also why i don't get the negative role assumption, you gave multiple and somehow went for that because "balancing". i am already disliking this idea just because of it's nature of disregarding possibilities in favor of "if negative role does this then that person must be scum" because anyone from the list can be from any side and it will still fuck things up regardless

in fact, i would rather go with what shin said. vote out bambi, and if he ends up town then vote me out if you really want to.

and if you somehow think i want to vote out bambi for an advantage because i somehow am scum to you, why would i want to be voted out the next day if i am wrong? this would become a massive disadvantage for scum if i was scum

and honestly, i'll be alright in becoming path points instead of just being nightkilled at n3

My scum reads:

Yhuan
Bambi