I haven't looked at all of them but the Oni is extremely overmapped. In fact I don't even think the Oni should really exist in partnership with such a song. Kind of disappointing to see considering Gezo is an experienced taiko mapper and he should at least understand this slightly.bomber34 wrote: o1q2a
cool but you might as well say why and which one since it sounds like you only mean one
forum
Junichi Masuda - Lavender Town Theme [CatchTheBeat|Osu|Taiko 70355t
posted
Total Posts
303
I am as well not much satisfied with that taiko diff to be honest, but that 2-diff rule made me do that... I didn't want to make a kantan or futsuu as they would just be horribly boring for everybody... I even find the Oni extremely boring D:Xakyrie wrote: 5c1j19
I haven't looked at all of them but the Oni is extremely overmapped. In fact I don't even think the Oni should really exist in partnership with such a song. Kind of disappointing to see considering Gezo is an experienced taiko mapper and he should at least understand this slightly.bomber34 wrote: o1q2a
cool but you might as well say why and which one since it sounds like you only mean one
Maybe it is because I am a total taiko noob but I enjoy the Oni ._.
I mean just because of some not-so-100%-well-thought rule you get a diff. that is a bit weird maybe. But horrible? lol
I mean except of 00:43:643 (130,131,132,133,134,135) - I cannot hear anything that is supposed to make the diff bad or even horrible.
Maybe there are one or two notes where d should switch with k or vice versa. Or find some notes which aren't so necessary, or add really to that overmapping stuff.
Overall I am not a fan of deleting any guest diffs.
Besides the standard converted Taiko diffs are even worse when it comes to Taiko. You just get for Taiko unfitting 1/2 dkdkdkdkdkdkdkdkd with some Ds
With nightcore mod the taikos sound even better So play with NC. It isn't that much harder
I mean just because of some not-so-100%-well-thought rule you get a diff. that is a bit weird maybe. But horrible? lol
I mean except of 00:43:643 (130,131,132,133,134,135) - I cannot hear anything that is supposed to make the diff bad or even horrible.
Maybe there are one or two notes where d should switch with k or vice versa. Or find some notes which aren't so necessary, or add really to that overmapping stuff.
Overall I am not a fan of deleting any guest diffs.
Besides the standard converted Taiko diffs are even worse when it comes to Taiko. You just get for Taiko unfitting 1/2 dkdkdkdkdkdkdkdkd with some Ds
So play with NC. It isn't that much harder Seph
If you can map stuff like this you can do everything you want. I absolutley do not see any problems here. About the Muzu: Futsuu would work better here as Muzu. However it is very hard to map something hard for this kind of Song. But does every Map have to contain a nearly-Insane Diff?Charles445 wrote: 2362o
Dude... I usually don't want to be that guy but uh, are you sure about this map?
I can't see very many people enjoying their 45 seconds listening to lavender town, it's a simple song that's more irritating/creepy than anything.
About Seph's Post, I honestly do not expect anything from a Normal CtB Diff.
uhh lol.Charles445 wrote: 2362o
Dude... I usually don't want to be that guy but uh, are you sure about this map?
I can't see very many people enjoying their 45 seconds listening to lavender town, it's a simple song that's more irritating/creepy than anything.
inb4 fuck off with your other map examples from 2010 and 2011
NotShinta - aha? - irritating
Jar - ztrout's Visit to The Proctologist - irritating and creepy
La Roux - Cover My Ears - irritating
Hans Zimmer - Samara's Song - creepy
Since when is there some kind of rule that says that you are not allowed to rank stuff like that?
already 8 favourites + 9 different people who starred the map
So again. I think it is enjoyed by people. It is not even the controversial version of the song.
If you don't like a map or song then don't play it. I would have already quitted osu! when i really had to play every annoying nightcore or anime map
I am sure about this map or else I would not go and modded around 45 maps to give this one attention
I don't want to be rude with this but just to say that I should consider giving this map up just because it is simple and creepy is not a valid reason imo.
I mean people have the option to play it with Nightcore. It isn't creepy at all with that. Also if the town alone (BG or SB whatever) freaks you out you can play with BG Dim up to 100% and disable whatever you want.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Seph wrote: e4q1c
ill be honest, this is probably the most boring ctb diff i ever checked, i actually dozed off while looking at it though i have a suggestion
00:10:720 (3) - dont make it a kick slider and just add another slider like this
trust me, it makes it a little less boring, lel
It is actually even an Easy CtB diff. which imo is more enjoyable than the other converted ctb diffs. Maybe the Hard is nice but overall i like it very muchStefan wrote: 5nd6l
Charles445 wrote: 2362o
About Seph's Post, I honestly do not expect anything from a Normal CtB Diff.
I can see about that slider suggestion
Seph
BATs shouldn't be criticizing song choice. You don't want to be that guy, well it's not appropriate for you to be that guy. Also I don't really know where you got the assumption that few people like the song enough to want to play it in osu! I wouldn't have made a difficulty if I didn't like the song.
Please stop the trolling, XATs. You know better.
Please stop the trolling, XATs. You know better.
One word: placebo.Charles445 wrote: 2362o
Dude... I usually don't want to be that guy but uh, are you sure about this map?
I can't see very many people enjoying their 45 seconds listening to lavender town, it's a simple song that's more irritating/creepy than anything.
Some days ago I saw many people in #osu wondering why this wasn't ranked yet, and well, I'm of thevery few people that enjoy playing this song. why don't give it a try :v?
Mercurial
OWNEEEEEEEEEEEEEEED.Stefan wrote: 5nd6l
About Seph's Post, I honestly do not expect anything from a Normal CtB Diff.
Really?Charles445 wrote: 2362o
Dude... I usually don't want to be that guy but uh, are you sure about this map?
I can't see very many people enjoying their 45 seconds listening to lavender town, it's a simple song that's more irritating/creepy than anything.
*brofist*bomber34 wrote: o1q2a
I would have already quitted osu! when i really had to play every annoying nightcore or anime map
I am sure about this map or else I would not go and modded around 45 maps to give this one attentionwhich seemed to work to at least some kind of attention
Seph
D: It is totally okay to say that you don't like it. Didn't say that you should stop that or so.
I made that diff for friends who suck at CtB and yes. I know. CtB isn't that hard and the Easy and Normal are Easy too in ctb.
But I think some people might get interested who never tried ctb before
I already said what I think about it earlier, no need to repeat
Anyway. Thank you for playing it :3 I mean it seems that i probaly won't get a rank because of Everything
so an opinion has more value. Even if it is negative.
I made that diff for friends who suck at CtB and yes. I know. CtB isn't that hard and the Easy and Normal are Easy too in ctb.
But I think some people might get interested who never tried ctb before
I already said what I think about it earlier, no need to repeat
Anyway. Thank you for playing it :3 I mean it seems that i probaly won't get a rank because of Everything
so an opinion has more value. Even if it is negative.
Seph
Uh, define trolling.. If saying my opinion is wrong simply because i'm a XAT, there's obviously something wrong here!TheVileOne wrote: 4cy22
lulz XAT trolling.Elly-chan wrote: 4b961
well you could always remove both difficulties in their entirety since I do agree with xakyrie
Ok, so this discussion is all supposed to be over the taiko difficulties, is it not? Please let's not jump to music choice. People can map as they please. There has to be a final decision soon about keeping the taiko difficulties or leaving them, because it seems I was not the only person who thought the maps played oddly (no offence gezo!! most likely just because the nature of the song)!! I am not here to pick fights, nor fuel them; I am here to ensure a decision is to be made as of this moment.
Hi. I got called to check this difficulties because of some discussions - which I have read now - and I do agree with Elly-chan:
It was a good idea from you Gezo, trying to have your own beats to make the map more interesting. But since the song contains plenty of different sounds, you should make the patterns more simple, like having this as hardets patterns: ddkkd/dkdkd instead of dk kddk for example.
Also I want to mention that the rule was supposed to give lower people access to lower difficulties, not the controversy case. Which means that a Muzukashii is also enough. I might be wrong, but as far as I some BATs said that we shouldn't sick way too much to rules and be in some case flexible. This would fit in our case.
So I'm giving you two suggestions:
1.) Since Muzukasii is overall fine, it can be kept as it is, while the Oni is going to be remapped. I think remapping 45sec are not a big problem at all, right Gezo? I would mod it to be able to rebubble it.
2.) Or we delete the Oni and just keep the Muzukashii.
To be a bit clear about the beat @ Gezo, here some examples how to map Oni instead:
00:01:178 - http://puu.sh/216ST
Uff, I mapped half of the map in a row. Sorry, didn't noticed since it is that short(took me max 30sec lol). oO
Anyway, that's how you could do it. Less notes which are following the song in a simple way. Also having SV 1.40 is probably advicable, since 0.7 makes the map stuffed together and a bit boring. BPM seems even slower as it is. And don't forget about the Hidden mode. You would be not able to play the maps like that.
Same SV suggestion for Muzu.
Also try to avoid such drastical changes in beat: 00:35:531 (73,74,75,76,77) -
Uff, sorry that I'm so accurate/nazi or how to say it. Hope I could help you guys.
Tell me if you need a mod to be able to bubble this map. I will be there.
I agree with this. The map it-self is mostly fine, the problem is rather the song. We have just two main sounds(which is the high- and low-pitch), so we should stick to them instead of making our own beats.Elly-chan wrote: 4b961
(...) because it seems I was not the only person who thought the maps played oddly (no offence gezo!! most likely just because the nature of the song)!!
It was a good idea from you Gezo, trying to have your own beats to make the map more interesting. But since the song contains plenty of different sounds, you should make the patterns more simple, like having this as hardets patterns: ddkkd/dkdkd instead of dk kddk for example.
Also I want to mention that the rule was supposed to give lower people access to lower difficulties, not the controversy case. Which means that a Muzukashii is also enough. I might be wrong, but as far as I some BATs said that we shouldn't sick way too much to rules and be in some case flexible. This would fit in our case.
So I'm giving you two suggestions:
1.) Since Muzukasii is overall fine, it can be kept as it is, while the Oni is going to be remapped. I think remapping 45sec are not a big problem at all, right Gezo? I would mod it to be able to rebubble it.
2.) Or we delete the Oni and just keep the Muzukashii.
To be a bit clear about the beat @ Gezo, here some examples how to map Oni instead:
00:01:178 - http://puu.sh/216ST
Uff, I mapped half of the map in a row. Sorry, didn't noticed since it is that short(took me max 30sec lol). oO
Anyway, that's how you could do it. Less notes which are following the song in a simple way. Also having SV 1.40 is probably advicable, since 0.7 makes the map stuffed together and a bit boring. BPM seems even slower as it is. And don't forget about the Hidden mode. You would be not able to play the maps like that.
Same SV suggestion for Muzu.
Also try to avoid such drastical changes in beat: 00:35:531 (73,74,75,76,77) -
Uff, sorry that I'm so accurate/nazi or how to say it. Hope I could help you guys.
Tell me if you need a mod to be able to bubble this map. I will be there.
Everyone is free to criticize whatever they want. Just having a title doesn't revoke the rights to speak our mind. Nobody is forcing anyone to do anything specifically either.TheVileOne wrote: 4cy22
BATs shouldn't be criticizing song choice. You don't want to be that guy, well it's not appropriate for you to be that guy. Also I don't really know where you got the assumption that few people like the song enough to want to play it in osu! I wouldn't have made a difficulty if I didn't like the song.
Please stop the trolling, XATs. You know better.
On topic.
I am complimenting you for mapping this, however I don't see it being that interesting because the song doesn't allow much here and overmapping this would be kinda meh. Just my 2 cents, I am not forcing anything here. <_<
That is pretty much what Charles probably said, just that you took his wording in a wrong way.
Oh, I also forgot to mention that the mapset it-self has been ed the 1. Juli, while the Taiko rule got approved the 29.Juli:
p/1697582
Should make everything easier now...?
p/1697582
Should make everything easier now...?
This is like the shittiest attitude ever for someone who keeps saying that wants to be a MAT.TheVileOne wrote: 4cy22
BATs shouldn't be criticizing song choice. You don't want to be that guy, well it's not appropriate for you to be that guy. Also I don't really know where you got the assumption that few people like the song enough to want to play it in osu! I wouldn't have made a difficulty if I didn't like the song.
Please stop the trolling, XATs. You know better.
Seriously, don't let this guy be a MAT...
okay guys. Seriously please stop it or discuss it private, ingame, forum pm whatever
I have no problem if you say that you don't like the map or song and if you think it is worth ranking or not.
But don't start to argue over this stuff like respecting each others opinion here >.>
I am already annoyed with so many things and I already try as good as I can to find a solution for everything.
Just help me making the mapset better or leave when you just want to start a fight
I have no problem if you say that you don't like the map or song and if you think it is worth ranking or not.
But don't start to argue over this stuff like respecting each others opinion here >.>
I am already annoyed with so many things and I already try as good as I can to find a solution for everything.
Just help me making the mapset better or leave when you just want to start a fight
It's actually fine to discuss this here. Also, keep one Taiko Diff since you do not need two Taiko Diffs. And it will be good. The CtB Diff itself should be kept simple and not so spectaculary. I agree that Oni isn't that good like Muzukashii which fits perfect imo. However, since you do not need two Taiko Diffs I would say that the Muzu is totally enough and nice playable. And as it got said some times the song choice should not change anything by mapping/modding/playing.
<3[Luanny] wrote: 1a3g5e
Don't give up on this, bomber. Your map is great and it deserves to be ranked.
There are people who likes your map and wants to see this ranked, like me.
That's all I can say. DON'T LET IT GO TO GRAVEYARD.
:3
yep. That's the way it will probaly goStefan wrote: 5nd6l
It's actually fine to discuss this here Maybe but why do i get the feeling that someone will at somepoint start something that will make it explode?..
Also, keep one Taiko Diff since you do not need two Taiko Diffs. And it will be good. The CtB Diff itself should be kept simple and not so spectaculary. I agree that Oni isn't that good like Muzukashii which fits perfect imo. However, since you do not need two Taiko Diffs I would say that the Muzu is totally enough and nice playable. And as it got said some times the song choice should not change anything by mapping/modding/playing.
You guys can have your opinions. I just don't think BATs should becoming in and making comments about song choices. If the BAT came in it's probably not a coincidence that he didn't mod it while this was bubbled. This could be an indication that the BAT is not modding/ranking said map purely because he doesn't like the song. What do you want people to think when you come in making such claims? Should BATs be selective in their songs, especially when fairness is a valued trait in osu!?
Also, elly I was not accusing you of anything more than making a suggestion that was unlikely to happen to follow a rule that shouldn't even apply in this case, and you also said it in a I don't even care if you do this kind of tone. At least that was the video <wtf- my auto correct is such a troll (vibe) I was getting from you. I'm sorry bomber I just wanted to clear those things up.
Can we just be reasonable? What does it take to rank this? It's been bubbled, so if you cannot find any rules that have been broken, then shouldn't it be ready to be ranked? If one of the taiko difficulties is not required, than surely we could keep one of them or else state what's unrankable about such a difficulty?
Also, elly I was not accusing you of anything more than making a suggestion that was unlikely to happen to follow a rule that shouldn't even apply in this case, and you also said it in a I don't even care if you do this kind of tone. At least that was the video <wtf- my auto correct is such a troll (vibe) I was getting from you. I'm sorry bomber I just wanted to clear those things up.
Can we just be reasonable? What does it take to rank this? It's been bubbled, so if you cannot find any rules that have been broken, then shouldn't it be ready to be ranked? If one of the taiko difficulties is not required, than surely we could keep one of them or else state what's unrankable about such a difficulty?
Sternschauer!! D:
, ,_
|`\ `;;, ,;;'
| `\ \ '. .'.'
| `\ \ '-""""-' /
`. `\ / |`
`> /; ^ ^ \
/ / | . ;
< (`";\ () ~~~ (/_ ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ﾟ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ﾟ★・ ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ﾟ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ﾟ★・
';;\ `, __ _.-'` )
>;\ ` _.'
`;;\ \-'
;/ \ _
| ,"". .` \
| _| ' /
; /") .;-,
\ / __ .-'
\,_/-"` `-'
..sieht ein wenig zerdrückt aus XD (das sollte ein pikachu sein D: XD)
Star für die map
, ,_
|`\ `;;, ,;;'
| `\ \ '. .'.'
| `\ \ '-""""-' /
`. `\ / |`
`> /; ^ ^ \
/ / | . ;
< (`";\ () ~~~ (/_ ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ﾟ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ﾟ★・ ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ﾟ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ★・。ﾟ・☆・ ﾟ★・
';;\ `, __ _.-'` )
>;\ ` _.'
`;;\ \-'
;/ \ _
| ,"". .` \
| _| ' /
; /") .;-,
\ / __ .-'
\,_/-"` `-'
..sieht ein wenig zerdrückt aus XD (das sollte ein pikachu sein D: XD)
Star für die map
Mercurial
Mikarunoel131_DELETED
I just love the song (and maps are good too) but the actual audio quality is awful, we can hear compression artifacts too much, and global song accuracy is just lost.
So please, if you are the one who remixed this, and if you have time, put your remix samples and effects again, over this full quality song, of original lavender town : FLAC or Original Song.
Remix this file (in the program you used to remix the song / apply effects, just open your project and replace the actual song by the flac I gave you (you can convert to wav if the software doesnt handle flac) and then export the new remix to mp3 VBR to keep most of its quality.
So please, if you are the one who remixed this, and if you have time, put your remix samples and effects again, over this full quality song, of original lavender town : FLAC or Original Song.
Remix this file (in the program you used to remix the song / apply effects, just open your project and replace the actual song by the flac I gave you (you can convert to wav if the software doesnt handle flac) and then export the new remix to mp3 VBR to keep most of its quality.
Before you guys go for it:
First check this post again: p/2116168
And then consider this mod:
[Muzukashii]
As I said before, it is better to use SV 1.40. 0.70 makes it like beeing even slower as the original BGM. Could be boring for more people in this way.
Hitcircles:
00:07:142 (16) - move to 00:06:187, else it feels too much misplaced.
00:16:446 (36,37,38,39,40) - D k d k d (same goes to other parts -> mapping beat wise)
00:35:531 (73,74,75,76,77,78) - Consider this to map beat based instead of using the second sound.
If you disagree I have no problem with it. It's just an advice by me.
First check this post again: p/2116168
And then consider this mod:
[Muzukashii]
As I said before, it is better to use SV 1.40. 0.70 makes it like beeing even slower as the original BGM. Could be boring for more people in this way.
Hitcircles:
00:07:142 (16) - move to 00:06:187, else it feels too much misplaced.
00:16:446 (36,37,38,39,40) - D k d k d (same goes to other parts -> mapping beat wise)
00:35:531 (73,74,75,76,77,78) - Consider this to map beat based instead of using the second sound.
If you disagree I have no problem with it. It's just an advice by me.
[General]
The spinner circle middle point is off-center.
[Easy]
00:12:629 (1) - This flows better ctrl + h'd. Also not very symmetrical.
00:33:623 (1) - Remove new combo
00:37:440 (1) - ^
[Normal]
00:14:537 (5) - Make up your mind on whether you want combos 1 measure long or 2 measures long.
00:22:172 (5) - ^
00:29:806 (5) - ^
[Taiko]
Why is the OD so low? Raise that.
[CtB]
00:46:983 - I'm surprised you didn't add the storyboard ghost here.
[TVO]
Add a spinner somewhere so that there can be variability in score.
The varying distance snap used all over during the intro makes for bad flow considering how little the music is changing (not at all)
In general the difficulty feels quite a bit harder in comparison to Normal. As much as I personally like them, the small circles and very large spacing is to blame here. Think you can tone it down a little bit to conform to the rest of the set better?
The spinner circle middle point is off-center.
[Easy]
00:12:629 (1) - This flows better ctrl + h'd. Also not very symmetrical.
00:33:623 (1) - Remove new combo
00:37:440 (1) - ^
[Normal]
00:14:537 (5) - Make up your mind on whether you want combos 1 measure long or 2 measures long.
00:22:172 (5) - ^
00:29:806 (5) - ^
[Taiko]
Why is the OD so low? Raise that.
[CtB]
00:46:983 - I'm surprised you didn't add the storyboard ghost here.
[TVO]
Add a spinner somewhere so that there can be variability in score.
The varying distance snap used all over during the intro makes for bad flow considering how little the music is changing (not at all)
In general the difficulty feels quite a bit harder in comparison to Normal. As much as I personally like them, the small circles and very large spacing is to blame here. Think you can tone it down a little bit to conform to the rest of the set better?
thank you :3Garven wrote: 2k1v16
[General]
The spinner circle middle point is off-center..__. okay let's see how i can fix that. Asked MLGnom ... let's hope he can help me :3okay MLGnom fixed it for me :3
[Easy]
00:12:629 (1) - This flows better ctrl + h'd. Also not very symmetrical. one of these moments where I think... why did i not see that earlier ^^ fixed :3
00:33:623 (1) - Remove new combo okay
00:37:440 (1) - ^I don't know. For me a new music phrase starts there. I can see why it is suggested but I really think there should be a NCremoved now
[Normal]
00:14:537 (5) - Make up your mind on whether you want combos 1 measure long or 2 measures long. Set new combo on each (5) spot you pointed out :3made it possible to get the right color on 00:39:348 (1) - too ^^ my minimalistic ghost slider, even though i think these (5) spots look better without a NC I don't mind that either ^^
00:22:172 (5) - ^ ^
00:29:806 (5) - ^ ^
[Taiko]
Why is the OD so low? Raise that. _Gezo_ said he answered you ingame ._. raised by one
[CtB]
00:46:983 - I'm surprised you didn't add the storyboard ghost here. dunno why i never thought about adding him there xD added, reason why it was not set there was actually because at first i wanted the SB only in E and N because the spinner makes the ghost effect in standard better. But since Hard should / had to have one too I can add it there as well
let's wait for TVO
Just saw this... shouldn't the artist name be Junichi Masuda?
Composers are usually credited first name then last name. The artist himself also romanizes his name as Junichi Masuda; for example see his twitter and this release which even says on the cover Junichi Masuda Selection CD and not Masuda Junichi Selection CD.
I think there's a strong case that the artist should be changed. (Yeah I know the thread is already LONG)
Composers are usually credited first name then last name. The artist himself also romanizes his name as Junichi Masuda; for example see his twitter and this release which even says on the cover Junichi Masuda Selection CD and not Masuda Junichi Selection CD.
I think there's a strong case that the artist should be changed. (Yeah I know the thread is already LONG
)
orz
p/2106990
and before anyone blames Melo.
The bubble pop came after Melo talked with me about this.
I really don't know why we even must have this rule. It only causes confusion
anyway ... unless a BAT says now that I should change I will keep this thing in mind and so
I changed it because I couldn't find any album with a quick google search, and wikipedia gave me the japanese way and so ... uh.
So I agreed with Melo and changed it to the way it is now
So my questions:
If I have to change it:
Completly deleting the whole japanese written way?
Or somehow make it like the name on twitter .__.
Or just change the romanised way ._.
EDIT
p/2124611 recent map that seems to do the similar thing
hope people can live with that ... hopefully
p/2106990
and before anyone blames Melo.
The bubble pop came after Melo talked with me about this.
I really don't know why we even must have this rule. It only causes confusion
anyway ... unless a BAT says now that I should change I will keep this thing in mind and so
I changed it because I couldn't find any album with a quick google search, and wikipedia gave me the japanese way and so ... uh.
So I agreed with Melo and changed it to the way it is now
So my questions:
If I have to change it:
Completly deleting the whole japanese written way?
Or somehow make it like the name on twitter .__.
Or just change the romanised way ._.
EDIT
how it goes
20:15 bomber34: hi
20:16 bomber34: http://osu-ppy-sh.jeuxcrack.net/forum/p/2128387 there is a bit confusion now
20:19 Garven: Oh whoops
20:19 Garven: We usually put the jp artist name in the First -> Last name
20:19 Garven: Now that we have the unicode option as well, we can put the JP order as well
20:20 bomber34: well the suggestion i got is that I use the japanese way for the japanese letters and the western for the
romanised way. But nobody is sure about that either
20:21 Garven: Do it that way.
20:22 bomber34: okay. Will update when TVO gives me his update.
p/2124611 recent map that seems to do the similar thing
hope people can live with that ... hopefully
EDIT:
See also:
That's it. I would appreciate if you guys give me your thoughts. And gather further opinions if possible.
@bomber34: I'm sorry to bother you with this. me if you or Garven thinks rebubble is necessary. I'll gladly help you out.
I think your case doesn't matter much. Everytime we romanize our names we use "firstname => surname" format. Go check Wikipedia and you'll notice it's using that format too. And for japanese people, it is taken for granted so we never use "surname => firstname" in public places, which is including Twitter, and CD cover too. This is why he uses "Junichi Masuda". That's not his own argument, but common sense among japanese people. As a japanese person, I don't think it's appropriate to use "Junichi Masuda" just because he's using it in several places.Shulin wrote: 50b6b
Just saw this... shouldn't the artist name be Junichi Masuda?
Composers are usually credited first name then last name. The artist himself also romanizes his name as Junichi Masuda; for example see his twitter and this release which even says on the cover Junichi Masuda Selection CD and not Masuda Junichi Selection CD.
I think there's a strong case that the artist should be changed. (Yeah I know the thread is already LONG
See also:
The problem is, the ranking rules state "Eastern artists must be written in the proper 'surname firstname' format". I'm not sure if it makes sense and is even necessary, but rule is exactly rule. Obviously MAT shouldn't encourage mappers to scrap rules as we're here to enforce them upon mappers.Suzully wrote: 6z6m2x
A Japanese person's name consists of family name first and first name next.(a rule of osu follows this)
However in an official place(like iTunes store), we write our first names first, and write our family names next as well as other countries.
That's it. I would appreciate if you guys give me your thoughts. And gather further opinions if possible.
@bomber34: I'm sorry to bother you with this. me if you or Garven thinks rebubble is necessary. I'll gladly help you out.
Well I was thinking of this rule from a worldwide perspective, but I do understand that it's probably strange for you to see the name romanised like this but at least we have the option to put Japanese characters now which can follow the Japanese format.Melophobia wrote: 522q4p
EDIT:I think your case doesn't matter much. Everytime we romanize our names we use "firstname => surname" format. Go check Wikipedia and you'll notice it's using that format too. And for japanese people, it is taken for granted so we never use "surname => firstname" in public places, which is including Twitter, and CD cover too. This is why he uses "Junichi Masuda". That's not his own argument, but common sense among japanese people. As a japanese person, I don't think it's appropriate to use "Junichi Masuda" just because he's using it in several places.
See also:
The problem is, the ranking rules state "Eastern artists must be written in the proper 'surname firstname' format". I'm not sure if it makes sense and is even necessary, but rule is exactly rule. Obviously MAT shouldn't encourage mappers to scrap rules as we're here to enforce them upon mappers.Suzully wrote: 6z6m2x
A Japanese person's name consists of family name first and first name next.(a rule of osu follows this)
However in an official place(like iTunes store), we write our first names first, and write our family names next as well as other countries.
That's it. I would appreciate if you guys give me your thoughts. And gather further opinions if possible.
@bomber34: I'm sorry to bother you with this. me if you or Garven thinks rebubble is necessary. I'll gladly help you out.
I think that if a Japanese artist is using First Name Last Name format in official places when releasing material worldwide then it's important to use that standard since the majority of people who are familiar with the artist (outside of Japan) will be using that name. It would be strange to enforce this rule when there are official releases where the artist has shown a clear preference or is using First Name Last Name format by default; you could think of this like a stage name which isn't uncommon anywhere in the world. It should be up to the artist to decide what name they are known by and I think the rule should be flexible and accommodate this. Personally, I think this rule needs more discussion because there too many exceptions (especially for artists outside of Japan) but this thread probably isn't the place for that. ^_^
But they are before the rule?TheVileOne wrote: 4cy22
There aren't any other maps going by this method.
http://puu.sh/24zck
I think I actually said everything that came to my mind here p/2128412
I have no problem with changing anything here. But please ... agree to something D: I really don't want to keep changing the artist. That is annoying >.<
First of all, I'm so sorry for being so narrow‐minded. I was fairly impressed at Shulin's post. And honestly, now that both formats are fine to me.
Since I'm super tired and have to sleep soon, I'll just mess up here leaving the discussion log. orz
tl;dr We decided to let bomber34 decide, and he decided to keep the current one for convenience and consistency. Rebubbled~
Since I'm super tired and have to sleep soon, I'll just mess up here leaving the discussion log. orz
Garven
01:02 Melophobia: iru?
01:02 *Garven is away: Busy, sorry. 忙しいごめんなさい
01:23 Garven: x_x
01:24 Garven: hikouki kippu kaimonositeru
01:24 Garven: gomen mou chotto matte kudasai
01:24 Melophobia: aa
01:24 Melophobia: mou neru hitsuyou ga aru T_T
01:24 Garven: Pokemon no map no koto?
01:24 Garven: Artist name?
01:24 Melophobia: un
01:26 Garven: Whatever you decide is fine with me. I'll defer to your judgement on the matter.
01:26 Melophobia: actually i'm fine with both :v
01:26 Garven: orz
01:27 Melophobia: if the mapper wanted to keep it consistent with old ranked maps, then i wouldn't ask him to change
01:27 Melophobia: but he agreed with me and was willing to change it
01:27 Melophobia: so i popped after some discussion
01:27 Melophobia: for +5
01:27 Garven: Haha
01:28 Garven: Well, if you rebubble, then I can just rank
01:28 Garven: Since I probably popped from TVO's big changes
01:29 Melophobia: I'd like to continue to discuss a bit more
01:30 Melophobia: although im totally fine with both formats, i wouldn't call the current state the final
01:30 Melophobia: so i wanted to ask for your thoughts on it o.o
01:31 Garven: Since we have the Unicode format available now, I'd prefer to see the Western format with the western characters
01:31 Garven: And the original country's format in the unicode
01:31 Garven: That makes the most sense to me
01:32 Melophobia: yes.. but the rule is sticking in my head
01:32 Garven: We can make a proposition to change it
01:32 Garven: Once osz2 comes out, we can change it without a need to unrank
01:33 Melophobia: but rule is still existing
01:34 Melophobia: enforce the rule for now and better to wait for removal of rule
01:34 Garven: Sure
01:34 Garven: I honestly can't which way the rule is stated w
01:35 Garven: I mostly don't care as long as we have the name right
01:35 Melophobia: same here
01:35 Garven: Okay, then follow rule for this one
01:35 Garven: Propose a change afterward
01:36 Melophobia: sure
02:29 Melophobia: http://puu.sh/24C0y
02:29 Melophobia: chotto atama itai desu orz
02:30 Garven: >_>
02:30 Garven: em
02:30 Garven: Nobody cares www
02:31 Melophobia: e?
02:31 Garven: You don't care
02:31 Garven: I don't care
02:31 Garven: Shulin doesn't care
02:32 Melophobia: and the mapper doesn't care
02:32 Garven: mou
02:32 Melophobia: ah
02:32 Melophobia: he said he wants to use the current one
02:32 Garven: Then let's use the current one.
02:32 Melophobia: ok
02:33 Melophobia: i'll rebubble soon~~
01:02 *Garven is away: Busy, sorry. 忙しいごめんなさい
01:23 Garven: x_x
01:24 Garven: hikouki kippu kaimonositeru
01:24 Garven: gomen mou chotto matte kudasai
01:24 Melophobia: aa
01:24 Melophobia: mou neru hitsuyou ga aru T_T
01:24 Garven: Pokemon no map no koto?
01:24 Garven: Artist name?
01:24 Melophobia: un
01:26 Garven: Whatever you decide is fine with me. I'll defer to your judgement on the matter.
01:26 Melophobia: actually i'm fine with both :v
01:26 Garven: orz
01:27 Melophobia: if the mapper wanted to keep it consistent with old ranked maps, then i wouldn't ask him to change
01:27 Melophobia: but he agreed with me and was willing to change it
01:27 Melophobia: so i popped after some discussion
01:27 Melophobia: for +5
01:27 Garven: Haha
01:28 Garven: Well, if you rebubble, then I can just rank
01:28 Garven: Since I probably popped from TVO's big changes
01:29 Melophobia: I'd like to continue to discuss a bit more
01:30 Melophobia: although im totally fine with both formats, i wouldn't call the current state the final
01:30 Melophobia: so i wanted to ask for your thoughts on it o.o
01:31 Garven: Since we have the Unicode format available now, I'd prefer to see the Western format with the western characters
01:31 Garven: And the original country's format in the unicode
01:31 Garven: That makes the most sense to me
01:32 Melophobia: yes.. but the rule is sticking in my head
01:32 Garven: We can make a proposition to change it
01:32 Garven: Once osz2 comes out, we can change it without a need to unrank
01:33 Melophobia: but rule is still existing
01:34 Melophobia: enforce the rule for now and better to wait for removal of rule
01:34 Garven: Sure
01:34 Garven: I honestly can't which way the rule is stated w
01:35 Garven: I mostly don't care as long as we have the name right
01:35 Melophobia: same here
01:35 Garven: Okay, then follow rule for this one
01:35 Garven: Propose a change afterward
01:36 Melophobia: sure
02:29 Melophobia: http://puu.sh/24C0y
02:29 Melophobia: chotto atama itai desu orz
02:30 Garven: >_>
02:30 Garven: em
02:30 Garven: Nobody cares www
02:31 Melophobia: e?
02:31 Garven: You don't care
02:31 Garven: I don't care
02:31 Garven: Shulin doesn't care
02:32 Melophobia: and the mapper doesn't care
02:32 Garven: mou
02:32 Melophobia: ah
02:32 Melophobia: he said he wants to use the current one
02:32 Garven: Then let's use the current one.
02:32 Melophobia: ok
02:33 Melophobia: i'll rebubble soon~~
Shulin
02:02 Melophobia: hi
02:02 Shulin: hey
02:03 Melophobia: first of all, thank you for your opinion, that's quite impressive to me
02:03 Melophobia: I was a bit too narrow‐minded apparently, sorry for that
02:04 Shulin: It's fine, I understand your concerns xD
02:05 Melophobia: I talked with Garven and we decided to follow the current rule for now
02:06 Shulin: Honestly, I think the rule needs more thought
02:06 Melophobia: but it doesn't mean we are going to throw away your opinion
02:06 Melophobia: http://puu.sh/24AK3
02:06 Melophobia: here's the log
02:07 Melophobia: my point is,
02:07 Melophobia: I will enforce the rule for now since it's still existing
02:07 Melophobia: but after looking into your thought, I find the rule to be just stupid or confusing
02:08 Shulin: Ahh I understand that, actually I think a change should be proposed first before enforcing it =P
02:08 Shulin: It's very confusing since all the previous maps are using the other format
02:10 Melophobia: yeah
02:11 Melophobia: we just need to discuss it and the said rule should be removed because of artist unicode
02:12 Melophobia: and osz2 will enable us to change old ranked maps without unranking
02:12 Melophobia: umm i lost my point..
02:12 Melophobia: i just wanted to see your thought on this
02:13 Shulin: well i'm fine either way, I don't want to make a big fuss over it
02:13 Shulin: I think I'd want to keep it consistent with the older maps for now
02:13 Shulin: just because if you were to search for the artist in game it'd be strange
02:14 Melophobia: but they were ranked when the said rule wasn't formulated yet, apparently
02:14 Shulin: and if you search junichi masuda in game for example, you don't get this map if it's listed as masuda junichi
02:14 Melophobia: I don't know because I haven't arrived here yet at that time :v
02:14 Melophobia: that's right
02:15 Shulin: I actually don't know when this new rule was introduced
02:15 Shulin: fairly recently I think
02:15 Melophobia: at least when i started mapping it was already there
02:16 Shulin: the only discussion I can find is 7 months old
02:16 Shulin: but the result was inconclusive, it didn't seem there was an argreement =S
02:16 Melophobia: abalee's thread?
02:16 Shulin: yep
02:17 Melophobia: umm
02:17 Melophobia: now that i don't know what to do..
02:19 Shulin: it's so confusing! xD
02:19 Shulin: well we could open a discussion in mod lounge forum
02:19 Shulin: or just let the mapper decide which they prefer
02:20 Shulin: with osz2 it can be changed anyway, so it can be changed to whatever the rule may be then
02:21 Melophobia: alright
02:22 Melophobia: as i said in the log i wouldn't care about it if the mapper didn't want to
02:22 Melophobia: well then i'll tell him about this
02:23 Shulin: okay ^_^
02:23 Melophobia: thanks so much!
02:23 Shulin: no problem!
02:02 Shulin: hey
02:03 Melophobia: first of all, thank you for your opinion, that's quite impressive to me
02:03 Melophobia: I was a bit too narrow‐minded apparently, sorry for that
02:04 Shulin: It's fine, I understand your concerns xD
02:05 Melophobia: I talked with Garven and we decided to follow the current rule for now
02:06 Shulin: Honestly, I think the rule needs more thought
02:06 Melophobia: but it doesn't mean we are going to throw away your opinion
02:06 Melophobia: http://puu.sh/24AK3
02:06 Melophobia: here's the log
02:07 Melophobia: my point is,
02:07 Melophobia: I will enforce the rule for now since it's still existing
02:07 Melophobia: but after looking into your thought, I find the rule to be just stupid or confusing
02:08 Shulin: Ahh I understand that, actually I think a change should be proposed first before enforcing it =P
02:08 Shulin: It's very confusing since all the previous maps are using the other format
02:10 Melophobia: yeah
02:11 Melophobia: we just need to discuss it and the said rule should be removed because of artist unicode
02:12 Melophobia: and osz2 will enable us to change old ranked maps without unranking
02:12 Melophobia: umm i lost my point..
02:12 Melophobia: i just wanted to see your thought on this
02:13 Shulin: well i'm fine either way, I don't want to make a big fuss over it
02:13 Shulin: I think I'd want to keep it consistent with the older maps for now
02:13 Shulin: just because if you were to search for the artist in game it'd be strange
02:14 Melophobia: but they were ranked when the said rule wasn't formulated yet, apparently
02:14 Shulin: and if you search junichi masuda in game for example, you don't get this map if it's listed as masuda junichi
02:14 Melophobia: I don't know because I haven't arrived here yet at that time :v
02:14 Melophobia: that's right
02:15 Shulin: I actually don't know when this new rule was introduced
02:15 Shulin: fairly recently I think
02:15 Melophobia: at least when i started mapping it was already there
02:16 Shulin: the only discussion I can find is 7 months old
02:16 Shulin: but the result was inconclusive, it didn't seem there was an argreement =S
02:16 Melophobia: abalee's thread?
02:16 Shulin: yep
02:17 Melophobia: umm
02:17 Melophobia: now that i don't know what to do..
02:19 Shulin: it's so confusing! xD
02:19 Shulin: well we could open a discussion in mod lounge forum
02:19 Shulin: or just let the mapper decide which they prefer
02:20 Shulin: with osz2 it can be changed anyway, so it can be changed to whatever the rule may be then
02:21 Melophobia: alright
02:22 Melophobia: as i said in the log i wouldn't care about it if the mapper didn't want to
02:22 Melophobia: well then i'll tell him about this
02:23 Shulin: okay ^_^
02:23 Melophobia: thanks so much!
02:23 Shulin: no problem!
bomber34
01:36 Melophobia: around?
01:37 bomber34: yes
01:37 Melophobia: this may be the final :v
01:37 Melophobia: http://puu.sh/24AK3
01:40 bomber34: okay read it. So just to be sure. I re-do it? Masuda Junichi?
01:40 Melophobia: Yes
01:41 bomber34: okay. orz haha then i just should have let it how it was yesterday. But (hopefully) you read the short IRC discussion i had with Garven ^^ oh well. I gonna change it now
01:41 bomber34: okay. orz haha then i just should have let it how it was yesterday. But (hopefully) you read the short IRC discussion i had with Garven ^^ oh well. I gonna change it now
01:43 bomber34: Is it okay if i post your IRC chat too?
01:43 bomber34: So that the discussion doesn't start again?
01:44 Melophobia: I'll do that when I rebubble
01:44 bomber34: oh okay :3
01:44 Melophobia: I still need to state something important :3
01:44 bomber34: something else?
01:45 Melophobia: don't worry, just an apology xD
01:45 bomber34: It is not your fault ._.
01:46 Melophobia: at least I should have explained better when i popped the bubble
01:47 bomber34: well i still think that people would have argued about that
01:47 Melophobia: rule?
01:47 Melophobia: or masuda?
01:49 bomber34: both
01:50 bomber34: I mean they would argue there are older maps who have it the other way (but they were before the rule)
01:50 bomber34: or they still would have brought other examples of the artist
01:51 Melophobia: that's just nonsense to me. don't even care
01:51 Melophobia: the problem is that rule itself
01:52 bomber34: have to say it is really confusing to me ._. I mean it seems like the staff is not sure/ confident about it either yet
01:54 Melophobia: if there isn't the said rule it'll less confusing? i don't think so..
01:54 Melophobia: *it'll be
01:54 bomber34: no not that
01:54 bomber34: I mean that people aren't sure when to do it or when not
01:55 Melophobia: a bit confused now..
01:55 Melophobia: my english sucks, sorry o_o
01:56 bomber34: my japanese sucks .... (0% skill) so you have more options than me at least
01:57 bomber34: I mean. I linked a recent map thread in my first post after Shulin said that to me
01:57 bomber34: There the artist format was made like in my case. That the unicode is the eastern way
01:57 bomber34: and the romanised one is the western way
01:58 Melophobia: yes?
01:58 bomber34: I mean that the staff is not sure if that is the right way or not
01:58 bomber34: staff, XAT team ... idk D:
01:59 Melophobia: as that's not formulated yet..
02:00 Melophobia: probably we'll have discussion very soon. but that's not a good reason to wait you so long i think
02:01 Melophobia: terrible english.. but oh well
02:01 bomber34: it isn't that bad D:
02:01 bomber34: anyway... Shulin is talking to me right now
02:01 Melophobia: so I made up my mind to follow the current rule for now and wait for osz2, or new rule
02:02 bomber34: can you sent him or her the IRC dialogue
02:02 Melophobia: umm, sure
02:07 bomber34: orz. So Shulin tells me now to not change artist ...
02:07 bomber34: can you talk with Shulin?
02:08 Melophobia: yes
02:24 Melophobia: http://puu.sh/24C0y
02:24 Melophobia: ~
02:27 bomber34: so .... it is up to me?
02:27 Melophobia: yes, apparently
02:28 Melophobia: personally prefer sticking to the rule, but shulin's point is right too
02:28 Melophobia: > 02:14 Shulin: and if you search junichi masuda in game for example, you don't get this map if it's listed as masuda junichi
02:29 bomber34: xD okay .... I personally think it would be best then to use Junichi Masuda for now. Like you said ... with osz2 you can change it if needed. I think people would like to find all Masuda maps that they have if they search for it
02:29 bomber34: xD okay .... I personally think it would be best then to use Junichi Masuda for now. Like you said ... with osz2 you can change it if needed. I think people would like to find all Masuda maps that they have if they search for it
02:30 Melophobia: ok
02:30 bomber34: actually i am open for everything. I see both sides and can agree to them but for now it will be less trouble with Junichi Masuda
02:31 bomber34: and please ^_^ re-discuss this rule xD
02:32 Melophobia: sure
01:37 bomber34: yes
01:37 Melophobia: this may be the final :v
01:37 Melophobia: http://puu.sh/24AK3
01:40 bomber34: okay read it. So just to be sure. I re-do it? Masuda Junichi?
01:40 Melophobia: Yes
01:41 bomber34: okay. orz haha then i just should have let it how it was yesterday. But (hopefully) you read the short IRC discussion i had with Garven ^^ oh well. I gonna change it now
01:41 bomber34: okay. orz haha then i just should have let it how it was yesterday. But (hopefully) you read the short IRC discussion i had with Garven ^^ oh well. I gonna change it now
01:43 bomber34: Is it okay if i post your IRC chat too?
01:43 bomber34: So that the discussion doesn't start again?
01:44 Melophobia: I'll do that when I rebubble
01:44 bomber34: oh okay :3
01:44 Melophobia: I still need to state something important :3
01:44 bomber34: something else?
01:45 Melophobia: don't worry, just an apology xD
01:45 bomber34: It is not your fault ._.
01:46 Melophobia: at least I should have explained better when i popped the bubble
01:47 bomber34: well i still think that people would have argued about that
01:47 Melophobia: rule?
01:47 Melophobia: or masuda?
01:49 bomber34: both
01:50 bomber34: I mean they would argue there are older maps who have it the other way (but they were before the rule)
01:50 bomber34: or they still would have brought other examples of the artist
01:51 Melophobia: that's just nonsense to me. don't even care
01:51 Melophobia: the problem is that rule itself
01:52 bomber34: have to say it is really confusing to me ._. I mean it seems like the staff is not sure/ confident about it either yet
01:54 Melophobia: if there isn't the said rule it'll less confusing? i don't think so..
01:54 Melophobia: *it'll be
01:54 bomber34: no not that
01:54 bomber34: I mean that people aren't sure when to do it or when not
01:55 Melophobia: a bit confused now..
01:55 Melophobia: my english sucks, sorry o_o
01:56 bomber34: my japanese sucks .... (0% skill) so you have more options than me at least
01:57 bomber34: I mean. I linked a recent map thread in my first post after Shulin said that to me
01:57 bomber34: There the artist format was made like in my case. That the unicode is the eastern way
01:57 bomber34: and the romanised one is the western way
01:58 Melophobia: yes?
01:58 bomber34: I mean that the staff is not sure if that is the right way or not
01:58 bomber34: staff, XAT team ... idk D:
01:59 Melophobia: as that's not formulated yet..
02:00 Melophobia: probably we'll have discussion very soon. but that's not a good reason to wait you so long i think
02:01 Melophobia: terrible english.. but oh well
02:01 bomber34: it isn't that bad D:
02:01 bomber34: anyway... Shulin is talking to me right now
02:01 Melophobia: so I made up my mind to follow the current rule for now and wait for osz2, or new rule
02:02 bomber34: can you sent him or her the IRC dialogue
02:02 Melophobia: umm, sure
02:07 bomber34: orz. So Shulin tells me now to not change artist ...
02:07 bomber34: can you talk with Shulin?
02:08 Melophobia: yes
02:24 Melophobia: http://puu.sh/24C0y
02:24 Melophobia: ~
02:27 bomber34: so .... it is up to me?
02:27 Melophobia: yes, apparently
02:28 Melophobia: personally prefer sticking to the rule, but shulin's point is right too
02:28 Melophobia: > 02:14 Shulin: and if you search junichi masuda in game for example, you don't get this map if it's listed as masuda junichi
02:29 bomber34: xD okay .... I personally think it would be best then to use Junichi Masuda for now. Like you said ... with osz2 you can change it if needed. I think people would like to find all Masuda maps that they have if they search for it
02:29 bomber34: xD okay .... I personally think it would be best then to use Junichi Masuda for now. Like you said ... with osz2 you can change it if needed. I think people would like to find all Masuda maps that they have if they search for it
02:30 Melophobia: ok
02:30 bomber34: actually i am open for everything. I see both sides and can agree to them but for now it will be less trouble with Junichi Masuda
02:31 bomber34: and please ^_^ re-discuss this rule xD
02:32 Melophobia: sure
tl;dr We decided to let bomber34 decide, and he decided to keep the current one for convenience and consistency. Rebubbled~
